Bomber Shocks

Hey guys, I race a bomber in minnesota, it is an 84 monte carlo, 800 lf 900 rf, about 130 in the rear straight up, car weighs about 3100 lbs, we have now weight limit but also things must stay strictly stock and no ballast may be added, anyhow the car is fast, i just need some advice on how to keep the car rolling over in the corner so bad, 6" ride height, and $40 per shock rule, have run Pro shocks but no longer allowed, so i would like to know which stock (napa, carquest, o reilly, etc....) are the best for my aplication, this is on a paperclip 1/4 mile with about 6 degrees of banking

THANKS!!!  

I just have 2 questions.
1.I think you meant to say you want to keep the car from rolling over in the corner is that what you meant to say?
2. Can you use an adjustable shock as long as it's $40.00 per.shock
3. I lied a third question. Do you use bump stops to limit the travel of the front end??  
I'll check back and I'll see what I can come up with in the mean time.
4. Lied again,so the turns are very short and sharp.
Bob  

Minnesota huh, what part?

For the shocks, I would look at the brand each store carries. I believe Autozone has Gabriel or Bilstein and O'reilly's has Monroe from what I remember. Napa & Carquest just make their own numbers and box, but, I think they carry Monroe too.

Look at the ratings each shock may have because there are variations between stock shocks due to vehicle weight. What you want to look at is the  "shock absorber ratio" for example 50/50. This tells us the jounce resistance, or upward motion of our shock absorber is the same as our downward motion or rebound. The greater the number equals greater the resistance to movement. Sorry, I am not able to help as far as if the part number indicates the ratio or not. I will however be contacting a shock manufacturer tech personel in the near future since it would be nice to know if the numbers do tell or if we can only check in the catalog etc.  

This is one part catalog I do not have in my library.  

oxracing25:

Heres what I got from Moroso.I had no luck on the Napa,Gabriel,Kyb, I got Nowhere. If you want the Moroso numbers then maybe you can get to crossreference them. I had all the catalogs, my wife said what you going to with all these catalogs. I had some nice ones. I know Gabriel did make them. Napa I don't think they did, or I would have them in my street Monte Carlo, I just have the badest shock NAPA made for it.

Heres the Moroso Numbers:
THESE SHOCKS WILL COME UP AS DRAG RACE SHOCKS. Thats really what you want;30/70, 50/50, 40/60 Rears.

90/10, 30/70 40/ or 90/10, 40/60, 50/50 Fronts
Moroso C-2600 Front C-2720 Rear

Moroso C-2610 Front C-2720 Rear
C-2610 Front Drag Shock
Full Extended Lenght  15.34"
Collapased Lenght      9.62"
Diameter               1.63"

C-2600 Front Drag Shock
Full Extended Lenght  14.10"
Collapased Lenght      9.00"
Diameter               1.63"

C-2720 Rear Drag Shock
Full Extended Lenght  22.87"
Collapased Lenght     13.65"
Diameter               1.63"

I have had GM cars and trucks for some 40 years and GM is the most concistent one when it comes to parts ie. shocks. You'll see that there maybe shocks that fit your Monte Carlo and fit a (1968 NO Mistake) also. Some numbers even fit the big Station Wagons. I'm sure NAPN, CAR QUEST, someone should be able to cross the shocks for you. If you car is rolloing over on you put a 90/10 in that R/F corner. What a 90/10 shock does the resistence going up is lets say 10% as your car goes up and 90% as it goes down. You can tailer them in combos 70/30, 50/50 etc. I have some set up sheets I have used out here on the coast. If I can help you let me know.
Thanks
Bob

So many of my catalogs are gone too. I do have the GM Engineering books on the set-ups they used on Corvettes.Engine specs how the Ackerman theory plays a big part in race and street cars. How set-ups change as your pushing or pulling a car. A lot of good stuff. Its all the same theories of today for staock car racing rear wheel drive.  

Bob:

No we are not able to run adjustable shocks whether under 40 or not, and bump stops got disallowed after they found out i was using them haha.

And fahlin, I am racing at Raceway Park in Shakopee  

oxracing25:

holy crap.you can't do much in that r/f corner,there are ways around it(the GRAY AREA)..LOL...

Are you limited to Jounce? That dirty word...

Is there a place on the the internet where I can get some info. on your class of racing? if not could you supply me with just some info on the suspension part of the rule book that is the problem child. I'd appreciate it. Maybe I can figure something out and help you. If not I will just back off.

I'm an older guy. I'm retired. I'm a mechanical engineer, and live on the east coast. Have my own Hi-Po Machine shop. Do alot with drag racers and 1/4 mile tracks oval,paper clip in the area. Most at either 0 degree bank to 6-8 degree bank. There was a 3/8 mile track with 12 degree bank in NJ years back and Flemington NJ that was fast. If you would like some (old guy input) input let me know. I know I repeated myself DAH.....  
Thanks
Bob

I have the specs on the moroso shocks. Can you use a fleet type shock? ie from a bus or a frieghtliner truck etc. let me know and maybe you can run something on a different type valving. I once cut up shocks and made my own valving. Did a lot of crazy stuff back in the day.... Thanks again    

Here is the entire suspension rule that we have, (which now includes no use of bump stops) and hey i may only be 19 but my car was built solely on "old guy advice" from my dad, grandpa and
other family friends, so the more the merrier! and yeas in my opinion, i don't see why we couldnt run a fleet shock, not going to be noticed. Also there is no limit to jounce! Finallt if you would like to view the entire rule book for my class it is at www.goracewaypark.com and you would want to look for the "305 Bombers" under the rules and specification's tab!




13. Suspension: All suspension components must remain completely and strictly stock for model and year of car. No special order, police, taxi or other performance suspension components. No racing or rated springs allowed. Must be the same size left nd right. Maximum front spring wire diameter is .750”. Springs may be cut, but must have the same number of coils and be the same height side to side. OEM or replacement shocks must be in the original position and use the original mounts. No coil-over shocks or adjustable shocks. Retail price of shocks is $40.00 or less, each. No suspension spacers or wedge setting devices. Maximum camber is 1 ½“. Stock type rubber suspension bushings only. Maximum sway bar diameter is 1 1/16”. No rear sway bars. Urethane sway bar bushings are allowed in the link ends only.  

P.S. Found a shock that is made non-adj. in 90/10 70/30 or 50/50 they are Lakewood shocks, only issue is i can only find them as cheap as $41!!!!!! if you guys can find them for $40 or less they seem to be perfect!  

There's nothing wrong with being 19, I wish I was again...LOL........

Well my grandaughter turned 18 in NOV. So I am probably your grandad's age. Tell Grandad I was a (noname driver) back in the Gran National days and ranks of NASCAR back in the day. I mostly drove research cars. I drove modifieds, you know the guys that turn right to go left...LOL. I was born into racing my dad raced motorcycle hill climbs the old Jalopy days at the FAIR Grounds. Then in the early 1960s him and some friends got into drag racing. They purchased a 1964 Mercury Comet Caliente. It ran AA/G & A/FX as they were getting things built. I went to VIET-NAM in 1966. In 1968 they were done building it. They waited for me to come home.The summer of 68 was mostly spent on flogging the car. I came home from work one day and my dad unexpectedly died in 68. I had 4 younger brothers. The car was never really campained, so it is still in a nice warm garage still in its original build.Thats,thats.

(Thats why it takes so long for me to shower) gotta get all that oil off first.LOL...

I just what you to remember I will only give you my input your GRANDAD DAD and YOURSELF are the decision makers. OK with that said I have a couple things for you to remember. I will tell you somethings as long as you want my input remember you take this info as you want too.

1. REMEMBER IT TAKES 8,460 BOLTS TO BUILD AN AUTOMOBILE,AND ONLY ONE NUT TO SCATTER IT ALL OVER THE HIGHWAY.......

It will take me a day or so to find my roundy-round car set-up info and get it together. So bare with me as I will be back.. I'll help you as I can.
Thanks
Bob  

Bob, that is very cool to hear about your old driving days! I absolutely love hearing stories from "old timers " like you who have experience, and yes it sounds like you are very close to my grandfather's age.

But I would definitely love to have your input on how you think things may work to have this car go fast in circles lol. By the way, I am in training to be an automotive technician, so I am starting to understand just how much every single nut and bolt matters!!

No rush on the info, but yes it will be greatly appreciated!!
Thanks, Adam  

Adam:
If you want we can do this on a PM. So we don't upset anyone. What state are you from? I'm in Western,MA. My shop is in Ct. 60 miles away. Thats where I am now it's 3:23 A.M. I'm drinking my coffee and eating my sticky-bunn. It's a real big and sticky one this morning.Any way I went through that suspension info and they are actually taking things away from you even in a Bomber class.

What I'm looking for and it makes NO mention that it can't be done,is to install a fleet type front shock. Need to get one with your shock dimension. Because a lot of the big over the road trucks use them. My son has 5or6 Freightliners,and Peterbuilts for himself. These big shocks cost $35. to $60 bucks. Cheaper then a street car. But I will find it. Gabriel makes maybe a thousand different shocks,but I also noticed some have a 4to6 week leed time on them. We have a 1986 Monte Carlo SS. The F-41 suspension had a front and rear sway bar,and polyurethene bushings. I've never had to replace any in the rear. Bud I had to in the front sway-bar link. I replaced them withe Energy suspension parts from Jegs. Anyway the car only has 55,000 miles. Those bushings still squeek. When I;m going in the garage, and the chassis flexes. I purchased it for my wife for Christmas,We took delivery on 12/23/85. The paint is the only thingthat is spider webbing only the hood and trunk. So I had a friend take all the door dings out of it 6 years ago and haven't been able to paint it. I have all the stuff too.

Was you Monte originally equipted with the F-41 suspension. If it was an SS it was automatic. It was an option otherwise. You need the nose to stay up until you get on the binders or if your heading into the turn,you don't want so much front end drop that you get a push out of it.I don't know how the track is laid out so I don't know were and how hard your on your brakes.....I don't know how you work with friends if you share information or not? Thats what you do. How olds your grand parents, I don't know if I said I'm 64. Shops warming up gotta go do some work. Keep the greasy side down and the shiny side up!  
Thanks
Bob  

Hay yall,read the hole list of responses they are probly a lot of set ups that work,and some cost more than others.Im a old guy and a southern red neck.
i run a 1/2 mile 6 degree banked asphatl track. down here have a 1985 monte carlo bone stock only gutted doors for bars. have a consistent 24.50 lap and many wins. I have used about every kind of shock made and for a stock car the best is cheep old sensatrack all round car try my set up you may be supprised how good it works and its legal. I run 11 inch springs in the front and 12 inch in rear a 7/8 sway bar with factory bushings raise bar on rt side until it almost hits frame
and set left side 1/8 loose. springs rt ft 900 lft frt 1100 rr 175 lr 250 air pressure left side 24 psi rf 34 rr 28. try this whene you run off in the coner and the lft front locks up let off the brake and gas it up slightly it will feel like the rear is comming around dont let off as the car will set in the center and you can flat foot it from the middle off it will stick won many with this set up. hope it helps LD.  

Ox, my sister raced at Raceway. I was the pit chief etc. I grew up in Bloomington, now I am in NE Ohio. I see their Bomber regs are still the same. They need to allow different makes, IMO, besides GM for the bombers since they were (I am sure still are) struggling in car counts.

Here is what I found out if you go to a parts store, Monroe, you will want the Reflex model where you want stiff shock absorber. Monroe's website you will need to look through the specific dimensions of a Monroe Reflex model that match the basic OE replacement absorber. I'd be sure to check the cost on the Reflex because I am not sure how much they average. I was told Bilstein's website is about the same as finding what you need.

I don't know where you live in the twin cities area, but call Auto Parts Plus in Bloomington (I believe its called) used to be Red Rooster Auto Parts. Speak to Jim T. if you can, everyone their knows a good amount though. I used to work there as well.

Finding something will take a little time, but if you want a solid car you need to put some effort into it. I am trying to get my parts guy to get me a catalog   I know Gabriel actually lists the jounce and rebound pound ratings in their Truck/trailer catalog. I hope Monroe does the same for the regular automotive.

So what tech school you attending? DCTC or Hennipen or Dunwoody?  

Bob wrote:
"Any way I went through that suspension info and they are actually taking things away from you even in a Bomber class."
Bob, they restrict the class a lot, and the track is fairly flat too.

Bob wrote:
"What I'm looking for and it makes NO mention that it can't be done,is to install a fleet type front shock. Need to get one with your shock dimension. Because a lot of the big over the road trucks use them..."

This could be where I come in, I work at a truck & trailer parts counter. We stock the Gabriel brand regularly. PM if you, OP, are interested.